00:11:57 Jaroslava Schovancova: Would it be possible to upload the slides to indico? Or link them (if they are already available & accessible elsewhere)? 00:12:05 Hannah Short: Sure 00:12:49 Hannah Short: Added 00:14:33 Natalie Kane: What level is this aimed at? i.e. section, group, department or sector? 00:14:52 Hannah Short: Th 25% clusters? We’re not sure yet, the diversity office should be sending statistics 00:15:03 Hannah Short: I think it may be as far down as section level 00:15:15 Natalie Kane: OK thanks 00:19:15 Hannah Short: Ideas collected by the WIT Community https://cernbox.cern.ch/index.php/s/WQHMMmkLFy2t9GO 00:20:17 Vincent Brillault: How far is IT from both targets? 00:20:24 Hannah Short: Nationality = not sure 00:20:40 Hannah Short: Gender, we have about 12% females in technical job categories 00:20:40 Michael Davis: I agree with Wayne's comment, the last fellow list I checked had 6% female applicants. 00:21:07 Wayne Salter: More diverse for engineering jobs but less so for technician jobs 00:21:41 Tim Smith: Wayne, I understand that our new HRA was chosen as a knowledgable IT sourcing expert 00:21:52 Tim Smith: Whoops I meant HR recruiter 00:22:58 Tony Cass: Shouldn't we let Hannah show her slide? 00:23:24 Tony Cass: I think that addresses some of these points 00:23:26 Hannah Short: I’ll get there (thanks though!) :) 00:24:08 Maria Alandes Pradillo: Yes hello! :-) 00:24:24 Giacomo Tenaglia: it’s a bit small 00:25:38 Tony Cass: Here's the link again: https://cernbox.cern.ch/index.php/s/WQHMMmkLFy2t9GO#office 00:25:41 Juan Manuel Guijarro: What about having a Technical Student program only open to female? 00:26:23 Michal: We will be recruiting PJAS soon. How could we encourage cooperating institutes to provide more female candidates? 00:27:06 Tony Cass: PJASs will disappear. New graduate position programs... 00:27:10 Nils Høimyr: PJAS should be phased out, as that pipeline is part of the problem. 00:27:32 Spyridon Trigazis: Regarding outreach and the comments above, in the open source community, what is a relatively successful program is oureachy.org. Could we do something similar or even participate directly to outreachy? Maybe also discuss with outreachy.org 00:27:40 Wayne Salter: Do you have statistic regarding how many women leave c.f. men? 00:28:48 Benjamin Salignat: Latest Annual Personnel Statistics: https://cds.cern.ch/record/2771079?ln=en 00:29:59 Michal: I know PJAS will disappear, but we are hiring some right now, so for the immediate step it would be great to have more female candidates! 00:30:35 Maria Alandes Pradillo: Indeed, we are still hiring PJAS and I think home institutes are not following CERN best practices 00:33:00 Vincent Brillault: For the MPE 25% women target, given the current percent in LD/IC which will only (very) partially be renewed by that time, do we know what ratio we'll need to achieve on new recrutment for the upcoming 4 years? 00:33:32 Eric Grancher: About parental leave, possibility exists for a number of years at CERN to take a -unpaid- parental leave, sure it may not be always possible but maybe it could be better advertised (waiting for a longer paternality leave). 00:33:34 esindril: roughly 40% of all hiring should be females 00:34:16 Wayne Salter: That is very ambitious 00:34:35 Wayne Salter: I mean very challenging 00:35:27 Michal: How about contacting our cooperating institutes and proposing to organise an information session to advertise both the projects in general and diversity aspects? 00:35:44 Tony Cass: Disagree with Eric. Equality means men have to take the time off. Otherwise too many won't. And young staff probably can least afford unpaid leave. 00:36:11 Michael Davis: On Natalie's point: wouldn't it be better if scanning job descriptions for bias was something done routinely by HR? If it is up to the initiative of the hiring manager, not all job descriptions will be checked. 00:36:30 Nils Høimyr: Yes, not that many supervisors who are happy to give a fresh dad on an LD 6 months leave... 00:36:51 Benjamin Salignat: A little tool to check gender bias in job ads: http://gender-decoder.katmatfield.com/ 00:37:17 Giacomo Tenaglia: I echo Tony - I could only afford 2 weeks of unpaid leave at the time. And also because there’s the UNIQA contribution to be paid, which makes sense when having a newbord. 00:37:26 Giacomo Tenaglia: newborn* 00:37:56 Eric Grancher: Apologies, I have to leave for another meeting at 16h30. 00:37:59 Vasileios Naskos: I beleive that someone wants to leave and not continue to another contract has to do with the life in the area. Geneva is not one of the most easy cities (eg. for the housing) let alone the remote villages after the borders. 00:38:04 Tim Smith: Perhaps we could be pro-active in IT and nominate a “leave cover” role, rather than wait for CERN? 00:38:36 Tony Cass: Actually, leave cover does exist. But you have to pick someone from an employment agency. 00:38:41 Maria Alandes Pradillo: IMHO unpaid parental leave for men is not going to contribute to '25 by 25' (although I think we should still fight for equal maternity and paternity leave) 00:38:51 Tony Cass: So it doesn't work for engineers as much as for, say, admin posts. 00:39:17 Tony Cass: And you have to have the money to pay in your budget. HR won't pay. 00:42:43 Jan Iven: (are we actually doing "exit interviews" for female staff leaving? Did they just not get ICs, or did they not apply in the first place, did they have better (in what way?) offers elsewhere etc..?) 00:43:42 Hannah Short: We’re not doing (I believe) but definitely a good idea 00:44:27 Michal: I support what Tony just said 00:45:35 Jan Iven: (nationality (perhaps less visible whether we have 4% of Danes or just 2%..): used to be due to salary differences?) 00:47:55 Tim Smith: I agree we should help rotation to help liberate posts, but I suspect it is not just a question of assisting to find an interesting role, but the bigger problem of changing the advancement/promotion possibilities for non-hierarchical achievements 00:48:42 Andrei Dumitru: cd .. 00:49:32 Natalie Kane: I think there are HR fairs etc. but yes maybe we could be more involved in that? 00:50:11 Wayne Salter: Yes, my wife often takes part in HR recruitment firs 00:50:15 Wayne Salter: fairs 00:51:08 Juan Manuel Guijarro: How do we ensure that everybody involved in a selection process is aware of which gender and nationalites are underrepresented?. Do they see a dashboard plotting up-to-date information about it? 00:51:45 Tony Cass: Don't think you need a dashboard for gender! 00:52:13 Benjamin Salignat: Like this one 00:52:14 Benjamin Salignat: https://www.un.org/gender/content/un-secretariat-gender-parity-dashboard 00:52:18 Nils Høimyr: We typically know for our sections and groups. 00:52:23 Maria Alandes Pradillo: I thought D&I was going to do that for this exercise 00:52:41 Maria Alandes Pradillo: Well, they need the stats to measure how well this initiative is doing :-) 00:52:55 Hannah Short: Yeah, I think they are compiling them atm 00:53:35 Tony Cass: I meant so that those selecting would know which gender is underrepresented. 00:53:45 Jan Iven: (we could also replace the "underrepresented-only-counts-on-equal-candidates" tapdance with quotas (i.e give underrepresented groups a boost on scores/hiring)..? this has a negative whiff (we no longer chose the "best" applicant), but might be required to get closer to parity. 00:54:43 Maria Alandes Pradillo: But I think this is less problematic when hiring technical students, as it's about giving opportunities to young people who are willing to learn 00:57:59 Vincent Brillault: Rather than hoping that people use their own holidays/home leave to promote CERN back to their alma master (or generally their countries' universities), maybe it would be nice if there were some more incentives, like additional day(s) off to cover the investment? 00:58:10 Nils Høimyr: Maybe IT would be more attrictive to women if we focus more on users and applications and less on infrastructure. The ratio of female candidates for computing infrastructure is probably lower than higher up the application stack. 00:59:39 Maria Alandes Pradillo: I think that CERN should also be public in announcing that CERN is interested in recruiting more women and improving gender balance (same for certain underrepresented nationalities) 01:01:06 Michal: I like Vincent's idea :) 01:01:57 Fabio Luchetti: Do we have "easy to visualize" data on gender-gap vs nationality across the member state? and how this compare to the home-countries and the number of application? e.g. country X -> gender-ratio 80/20 country Y -> gender-ratio 60/40 https://cds.cern.ch/record/2771079/files/CERN-HR-STAFF-STAT-2020.pdf may be time-consuming to consult 01:02:06 Jaroslava Schovancova: What about organizing chat events on Reddit/Quora/social media? 01:03:13 Benjamin Salignat: Task force on data visualization to build something interactive? 01:04:00 Maria Alandes Pradillo: WIT has offered this to D&I at the time 01:04:07 Maria Alandes Pradillo: based on community effort 01:04:13 Hannah Short: https://mattermost.web.cern.ch/it-dep/channels/25-by-25 Mattermost Channel 01:04:28 Benjamin Salignat: thanks Maria 01:04:51 Maria Alandes Pradillo: Thanks a lot! 01:04:54 Jaroslava Schovancova: Thank you!