WLCG Management Board #318

513/R-068 (CERN)



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Simone Campana (CERN)

16:00 CERN/10:00 EDT/09:00 CDT

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Email Distribution List: worldwide-lcg-management-board@cern.ch
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Minutes: Management Board Meeting Minutes
Action List: MbActionList
See also the: WLCG Document RepositoryWLCG Web Site

WLCG Management Board
Zoom Meeting ID
Andrea Sciabà
Alternative hosts
Simone Campana, Maarten Litmaath
Useful links
Join via phone
Zoom URL
    • 4:00 PM 4:35 PM
      Minutes and Matters Arising 35m
      • Establishing the Technical Coordination Board and the Technical Forum 10m

        We drafted a paragraph about the Technical Coordination Board as part of the new proposal for Annex5. Below there is a revision based on the last WLCG workshop and Collaboration Board feedback: It highlights now the role of the Open Technical Forum. 



        The WLCG Technical Coordination Board (TCB) is responsible for the technical evolution of WLCG services in line with the needs of the experiments and the capabilities of the infrastructure providers. The TCB defines a multi-year roadmap for such evolution and is responsible for its implementation. The TCB achieves these goals with a bottom up approach through an Open Technical Forum (OTF) which welcomes the participation of all contributors to the technical evolution in the WLCG community. The TCB may establish ad hoc technical working groups and task forces and as deemed necessary to accomplish its responsibilities. The MB appoints the chair(s) of the TCB, for a period of four years acting as WLCG technical coordinators. The composition of the TCB should include representatives from the WLCG experiments, infrastructure and technology providers and should be agreed by the MB. 


        Next steps: 

        • agree on the above
        • appoint the co-chairs
        • Ask the co chairs to form the TCB and 1) identify the areas of work, 2) present their view about how to structure the TCB/OTF activities.
        • Endorse at one of the next MBs and launch (October)?   
      • DOMA Conveners 5m
      • WLCG representative in the HEPiX Board 10m
      • Workshop on environmental sustainability 5m
        Speaker: Simone Campana (CERN)
    • 4:35 PM 4:50 PM
      Decision on ARM following the GDB discussion 15m
      Speaker: David Britton (University of Glasgow (GB))

      The afternoon session of the GDB on 12th June 2024, was dedicated to a discussion of the status of ARM within WLCG. Each of the four main LHC experiments gave a presentation, followed by four presentations from sites with experience of providing ARM resources. The ATLAS experiment has validated 60% of their workload on ARM and is willing to accept ARM for up to 50% of the pledges from those sites with ARM resources. At this moment, this is a small number so the overall fraction of ARM pledged would expected to be small. The other three LHC experiments have all started the process of testing and validating ARM. All three have software capable of running on ARM and can submit to ARM resources. However, the initial tests have shown issues that still need to be resolved and, as is characteristic of such issues, it is hard to put a timescale on this work. ALICE are relatively close, and point out the value of testing on alternative architectures, which can show-up issues that might otherwise have remained hidden. CMS have pretty much validated Monte Carlo but need to resolve issues associated with real data. LHCb have only ported SIM-11 (not the current production version SIM-10) and need to resolve an issue associated with the calorimeter before doing the physics validation. All three of these experiments hope to make good progress by 2025 but it is clear that they are not ready to accept pledges for 2025 ARM resources that will need to be made in September 2024.

      The site presentations did not suggest there are any showstoppers in providing ARM resources. As with any new generation of hardware, minor differences were observed and some software for ARM does not yet exist or is in an immature state. However, it seemed clear that the ARM architecture is viable for work-nodes and that, following some one-off changes to adapt sites to the provisions of heterogeneous resources, there is no large additional effort required. 

      The conclusion of the meeting was that sites could use ARM resources to make up to 50% of their pledge to ATLAS for 2025, but they should not use such resources for pledges to any of the other LHC experiments at this point. This situation will be revisited in half a year, or so. It was also noted that accepting ARM as part of the pledge, implies a commitment by the community to support software for ARM for the life time of the hardware.

    • 4:50 PM 4:55 PM
      Action List Review 5m
    • 4:55 PM 5:05 PM
      WLCG Service Report 10m
      Speakers: Maarten Litmaath (CERN), Borja Garrido Bear (CERN)
    • 5:05 PM 5:15 PM
      LHCC Summary 10m
      Speaker: Simone Campana (CERN)
      • Analysis Facilities: set of questions presented and well received. They will be used by the LHCC to structure a charge for the review of the experiment plans. The review will happen in early 2025 (unlikely in late 2024). More details will come. The LHCC sees this as an iterative process.  
      • WLCG site, experiments, middleware providers were congratulated for the successful execution of Data Challenge 2024. The LHCC agrees with the idea of forming a team of experts working out the details of token implementation and support. 
      • Very positive feedback about the work on ARM and generally the the work to support for heterogeneous architectures. Glasgow T2 explicitly mentioned.   
      • Positive feedback about the CERN EP-SFT initiative on common ML activities and expects regular updates. 
      • The LHCC recommended that a future LHCC meeting include a presentation on how both SFT and HSF groups are collaborating towards the success of common scientific software. The future organisation of the common software input to the LHCC is being discussed.

      • (not spefific to WLCG) : an update of the LongShutdown-3 schedule will be discussed in September.  This is too late to take into account for the preliminary experiment requests for 2026, which need to be submitted  at the October 2024 RRB. We agreed with the experiments and the LHC Physics Committee to define two scenarios: 1) no run in 2026 and 2) full run in 2026 and present prelimirary requests for both. 
    • 5:15 PM 5:20 PM
      AOB 5m
      • Next MB Meeting: Tuesday 16 July 2024 1m